No FTL information implies no FTL travel?











up vote
3
down vote

favorite












The general consensus in the scientific community is that it is impossible to transmit information faster than light.



There is also speculation that it might be possible to open wormholes or travel faster than light with an Alcubierre Drive.



Wouldn't the first point render the second impossible? If both were valid points, you would get a contradiction because you could encode a message in the Alcubierre Drive payload (or send a messenger through a FTL spaceship) and therefore transmit information faster than light? Or is this a misunderstanding of the impossibility of transmitting information faster than light?



With wormholes, this is pretty much sidestepped because nothing is actually traveling faster than light, but rather moving through a shortcut in spacetime. You're essentially cheating, so this isn't particularly interesting and doesn't really break any laws of physics from what I understand.










share|cite|improve this question









New contributor




Beefster is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
























    up vote
    3
    down vote

    favorite












    The general consensus in the scientific community is that it is impossible to transmit information faster than light.



    There is also speculation that it might be possible to open wormholes or travel faster than light with an Alcubierre Drive.



    Wouldn't the first point render the second impossible? If both were valid points, you would get a contradiction because you could encode a message in the Alcubierre Drive payload (or send a messenger through a FTL spaceship) and therefore transmit information faster than light? Or is this a misunderstanding of the impossibility of transmitting information faster than light?



    With wormholes, this is pretty much sidestepped because nothing is actually traveling faster than light, but rather moving through a shortcut in spacetime. You're essentially cheating, so this isn't particularly interesting and doesn't really break any laws of physics from what I understand.










    share|cite|improve this question









    New contributor




    Beefster is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.






















      up vote
      3
      down vote

      favorite









      up vote
      3
      down vote

      favorite











      The general consensus in the scientific community is that it is impossible to transmit information faster than light.



      There is also speculation that it might be possible to open wormholes or travel faster than light with an Alcubierre Drive.



      Wouldn't the first point render the second impossible? If both were valid points, you would get a contradiction because you could encode a message in the Alcubierre Drive payload (or send a messenger through a FTL spaceship) and therefore transmit information faster than light? Or is this a misunderstanding of the impossibility of transmitting information faster than light?



      With wormholes, this is pretty much sidestepped because nothing is actually traveling faster than light, but rather moving through a shortcut in spacetime. You're essentially cheating, so this isn't particularly interesting and doesn't really break any laws of physics from what I understand.










      share|cite|improve this question









      New contributor




      Beefster is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.











      The general consensus in the scientific community is that it is impossible to transmit information faster than light.



      There is also speculation that it might be possible to open wormholes or travel faster than light with an Alcubierre Drive.



      Wouldn't the first point render the second impossible? If both were valid points, you would get a contradiction because you could encode a message in the Alcubierre Drive payload (or send a messenger through a FTL spaceship) and therefore transmit information faster than light? Or is this a misunderstanding of the impossibility of transmitting information faster than light?



      With wormholes, this is pretty much sidestepped because nothing is actually traveling faster than light, but rather moving through a shortcut in spacetime. You're essentially cheating, so this isn't particularly interesting and doesn't really break any laws of physics from what I understand.







      relativity faster-than-light causality information warp-drives






      share|cite|improve this question









      New contributor




      Beefster is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.











      share|cite|improve this question









      New contributor




      Beefster is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.









      share|cite|improve this question




      share|cite|improve this question








      edited 3 hours ago









      Qmechanic

      100k121811130




      100k121811130






      New contributor




      Beefster is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.









      asked 6 hours ago









      Beefster

      1161




      1161




      New contributor




      Beefster is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.





      New contributor





      Beefster is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.






      Beefster is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.






















          3 Answers
          3






          active

          oldest

          votes

















          up vote
          5
          down vote













          Note that I am by far an expert in this area, so sorry if I do not go as deep as you would like.




          The general consensus in the scientific community is that it is impossible to transmit information faster than light.




          This idea comes from special relativity. If information traveled faster than the speed of light, then causality becomes all messed up. This doesn't take into account the solutions of general relativity equations of things like wormholes.




          There is also speculation that it might be possible to open wormholes or travel faster than light with an Alcubierre Drive.




          The idea of wormholes or an Alcubierre Drive comes from solutions to equations in general relativity. As we currently know, these things are not physically possible. But they do not violate the first point because within the local space-time of the object nothing is is actually traveling faster than the speed of light. Space-time itself is manipulated in order for this "faster than light travel" to occur.






          share|cite|improve this answer






























            up vote
            2
            down vote













            Yes, your argument is correct.






            share|cite|improve this answer

















            • 1




              Wikipedia says otherwise en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre_drive
              – Aaron Stevens
              5 hours ago


















            up vote
            1
            down vote













            Alcubierre Drives also cheat. They essentially shorten the distance to your destination, so even though you're not locally moving faster than c, you can get there in less time than it takes light to get there through flat space.






            share|cite|improve this answer








            New contributor




            DaveC426913 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.


















            • So the distance is also shortened for everyone else who isn't in your spaceship? Sounds like a good way to mess up the universe.
              – immibis
              2 hours ago






            • 3




              @immibis Where are you getting that from? Even in special relativity, the spatial distance between points is not necessarily the same in two different frames.
              – probably_someone
              1 hour ago






            • 1




              @probably_someone "They essentially shorten the distance to your destination" - if it's only shortened for the people in the spaceship, but not for the people outside, then the people outside still see you carrying information faster than light don't they?
              – immibis
              1 hour ago













            Your Answer





            StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function () {
            return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function () {
            StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix) {
            StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["$", "$"], ["\\(","\\)"]]);
            });
            });
            }, "mathjax-editing");

            StackExchange.ready(function() {
            var channelOptions = {
            tags: "".split(" "),
            id: "151"
            };
            initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

            StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
            // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
            if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
            StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
            createEditor();
            });
            }
            else {
            createEditor();
            }
            });

            function createEditor() {
            StackExchange.prepareEditor({
            heartbeatType: 'answer',
            convertImagesToLinks: false,
            noModals: true,
            showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
            reputationToPostImages: null,
            bindNavPrevention: true,
            postfix: "",
            imageUploader: {
            brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
            contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
            allowUrls: true
            },
            noCode: true, onDemand: true,
            discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
            ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
            });


            }
            });






            Beefster is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.










            draft saved

            draft discarded


















            StackExchange.ready(
            function () {
            StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fphysics.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f446482%2fno-ftl-information-implies-no-ftl-travel%23new-answer', 'question_page');
            }
            );

            Post as a guest















            Required, but never shown

























            3 Answers
            3






            active

            oldest

            votes








            3 Answers
            3






            active

            oldest

            votes









            active

            oldest

            votes






            active

            oldest

            votes








            up vote
            5
            down vote













            Note that I am by far an expert in this area, so sorry if I do not go as deep as you would like.




            The general consensus in the scientific community is that it is impossible to transmit information faster than light.




            This idea comes from special relativity. If information traveled faster than the speed of light, then causality becomes all messed up. This doesn't take into account the solutions of general relativity equations of things like wormholes.




            There is also speculation that it might be possible to open wormholes or travel faster than light with an Alcubierre Drive.




            The idea of wormholes or an Alcubierre Drive comes from solutions to equations in general relativity. As we currently know, these things are not physically possible. But they do not violate the first point because within the local space-time of the object nothing is is actually traveling faster than the speed of light. Space-time itself is manipulated in order for this "faster than light travel" to occur.






            share|cite|improve this answer



























              up vote
              5
              down vote













              Note that I am by far an expert in this area, so sorry if I do not go as deep as you would like.




              The general consensus in the scientific community is that it is impossible to transmit information faster than light.




              This idea comes from special relativity. If information traveled faster than the speed of light, then causality becomes all messed up. This doesn't take into account the solutions of general relativity equations of things like wormholes.




              There is also speculation that it might be possible to open wormholes or travel faster than light with an Alcubierre Drive.




              The idea of wormholes or an Alcubierre Drive comes from solutions to equations in general relativity. As we currently know, these things are not physically possible. But they do not violate the first point because within the local space-time of the object nothing is is actually traveling faster than the speed of light. Space-time itself is manipulated in order for this "faster than light travel" to occur.






              share|cite|improve this answer

























                up vote
                5
                down vote










                up vote
                5
                down vote









                Note that I am by far an expert in this area, so sorry if I do not go as deep as you would like.




                The general consensus in the scientific community is that it is impossible to transmit information faster than light.




                This idea comes from special relativity. If information traveled faster than the speed of light, then causality becomes all messed up. This doesn't take into account the solutions of general relativity equations of things like wormholes.




                There is also speculation that it might be possible to open wormholes or travel faster than light with an Alcubierre Drive.




                The idea of wormholes or an Alcubierre Drive comes from solutions to equations in general relativity. As we currently know, these things are not physically possible. But they do not violate the first point because within the local space-time of the object nothing is is actually traveling faster than the speed of light. Space-time itself is manipulated in order for this "faster than light travel" to occur.






                share|cite|improve this answer














                Note that I am by far an expert in this area, so sorry if I do not go as deep as you would like.




                The general consensus in the scientific community is that it is impossible to transmit information faster than light.




                This idea comes from special relativity. If information traveled faster than the speed of light, then causality becomes all messed up. This doesn't take into account the solutions of general relativity equations of things like wormholes.




                There is also speculation that it might be possible to open wormholes or travel faster than light with an Alcubierre Drive.




                The idea of wormholes or an Alcubierre Drive comes from solutions to equations in general relativity. As we currently know, these things are not physically possible. But they do not violate the first point because within the local space-time of the object nothing is is actually traveling faster than the speed of light. Space-time itself is manipulated in order for this "faster than light travel" to occur.







                share|cite|improve this answer














                share|cite|improve this answer



                share|cite|improve this answer








                edited 5 hours ago

























                answered 5 hours ago









                Aaron Stevens

                7,92731235




                7,92731235






















                    up vote
                    2
                    down vote













                    Yes, your argument is correct.






                    share|cite|improve this answer

















                    • 1




                      Wikipedia says otherwise en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre_drive
                      – Aaron Stevens
                      5 hours ago















                    up vote
                    2
                    down vote













                    Yes, your argument is correct.






                    share|cite|improve this answer

















                    • 1




                      Wikipedia says otherwise en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre_drive
                      – Aaron Stevens
                      5 hours ago













                    up vote
                    2
                    down vote










                    up vote
                    2
                    down vote









                    Yes, your argument is correct.






                    share|cite|improve this answer












                    Yes, your argument is correct.







                    share|cite|improve this answer












                    share|cite|improve this answer



                    share|cite|improve this answer










                    answered 5 hours ago









                    tparker

                    22.4k147120




                    22.4k147120








                    • 1




                      Wikipedia says otherwise en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre_drive
                      – Aaron Stevens
                      5 hours ago














                    • 1




                      Wikipedia says otherwise en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre_drive
                      – Aaron Stevens
                      5 hours ago








                    1




                    1




                    Wikipedia says otherwise en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre_drive
                    – Aaron Stevens
                    5 hours ago




                    Wikipedia says otherwise en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre_drive
                    – Aaron Stevens
                    5 hours ago










                    up vote
                    1
                    down vote













                    Alcubierre Drives also cheat. They essentially shorten the distance to your destination, so even though you're not locally moving faster than c, you can get there in less time than it takes light to get there through flat space.






                    share|cite|improve this answer








                    New contributor




                    DaveC426913 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                    Check out our Code of Conduct.


















                    • So the distance is also shortened for everyone else who isn't in your spaceship? Sounds like a good way to mess up the universe.
                      – immibis
                      2 hours ago






                    • 3




                      @immibis Where are you getting that from? Even in special relativity, the spatial distance between points is not necessarily the same in two different frames.
                      – probably_someone
                      1 hour ago






                    • 1




                      @probably_someone "They essentially shorten the distance to your destination" - if it's only shortened for the people in the spaceship, but not for the people outside, then the people outside still see you carrying information faster than light don't they?
                      – immibis
                      1 hour ago

















                    up vote
                    1
                    down vote













                    Alcubierre Drives also cheat. They essentially shorten the distance to your destination, so even though you're not locally moving faster than c, you can get there in less time than it takes light to get there through flat space.






                    share|cite|improve this answer








                    New contributor




                    DaveC426913 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                    Check out our Code of Conduct.


















                    • So the distance is also shortened for everyone else who isn't in your spaceship? Sounds like a good way to mess up the universe.
                      – immibis
                      2 hours ago






                    • 3




                      @immibis Where are you getting that from? Even in special relativity, the spatial distance between points is not necessarily the same in two different frames.
                      – probably_someone
                      1 hour ago






                    • 1




                      @probably_someone "They essentially shorten the distance to your destination" - if it's only shortened for the people in the spaceship, but not for the people outside, then the people outside still see you carrying information faster than light don't they?
                      – immibis
                      1 hour ago















                    up vote
                    1
                    down vote










                    up vote
                    1
                    down vote









                    Alcubierre Drives also cheat. They essentially shorten the distance to your destination, so even though you're not locally moving faster than c, you can get there in less time than it takes light to get there through flat space.






                    share|cite|improve this answer








                    New contributor




                    DaveC426913 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                    Check out our Code of Conduct.









                    Alcubierre Drives also cheat. They essentially shorten the distance to your destination, so even though you're not locally moving faster than c, you can get there in less time than it takes light to get there through flat space.







                    share|cite|improve this answer








                    New contributor




                    DaveC426913 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                    Check out our Code of Conduct.









                    share|cite|improve this answer



                    share|cite|improve this answer






                    New contributor




                    DaveC426913 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                    Check out our Code of Conduct.









                    answered 3 hours ago









                    DaveC426913

                    1193




                    1193




                    New contributor




                    DaveC426913 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                    Check out our Code of Conduct.





                    New contributor





                    DaveC426913 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                    Check out our Code of Conduct.






                    DaveC426913 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                    Check out our Code of Conduct.












                    • So the distance is also shortened for everyone else who isn't in your spaceship? Sounds like a good way to mess up the universe.
                      – immibis
                      2 hours ago






                    • 3




                      @immibis Where are you getting that from? Even in special relativity, the spatial distance between points is not necessarily the same in two different frames.
                      – probably_someone
                      1 hour ago






                    • 1




                      @probably_someone "They essentially shorten the distance to your destination" - if it's only shortened for the people in the spaceship, but not for the people outside, then the people outside still see you carrying information faster than light don't they?
                      – immibis
                      1 hour ago




















                    • So the distance is also shortened for everyone else who isn't in your spaceship? Sounds like a good way to mess up the universe.
                      – immibis
                      2 hours ago






                    • 3




                      @immibis Where are you getting that from? Even in special relativity, the spatial distance between points is not necessarily the same in two different frames.
                      – probably_someone
                      1 hour ago






                    • 1




                      @probably_someone "They essentially shorten the distance to your destination" - if it's only shortened for the people in the spaceship, but not for the people outside, then the people outside still see you carrying information faster than light don't they?
                      – immibis
                      1 hour ago


















                    So the distance is also shortened for everyone else who isn't in your spaceship? Sounds like a good way to mess up the universe.
                    – immibis
                    2 hours ago




                    So the distance is also shortened for everyone else who isn't in your spaceship? Sounds like a good way to mess up the universe.
                    – immibis
                    2 hours ago




                    3




                    3




                    @immibis Where are you getting that from? Even in special relativity, the spatial distance between points is not necessarily the same in two different frames.
                    – probably_someone
                    1 hour ago




                    @immibis Where are you getting that from? Even in special relativity, the spatial distance between points is not necessarily the same in two different frames.
                    – probably_someone
                    1 hour ago




                    1




                    1




                    @probably_someone "They essentially shorten the distance to your destination" - if it's only shortened for the people in the spaceship, but not for the people outside, then the people outside still see you carrying information faster than light don't they?
                    – immibis
                    1 hour ago






                    @probably_someone "They essentially shorten the distance to your destination" - if it's only shortened for the people in the spaceship, but not for the people outside, then the people outside still see you carrying information faster than light don't they?
                    – immibis
                    1 hour ago












                    Beefster is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.










                    draft saved

                    draft discarded


















                    Beefster is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.













                    Beefster is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.












                    Beefster is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
















                    Thanks for contributing an answer to Physics Stack Exchange!


                    • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

                    But avoid



                    • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

                    • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.


                    Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.


                    To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.





                    Some of your past answers have not been well-received, and you're in danger of being blocked from answering.


                    Please pay close attention to the following guidance:


                    • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

                    But avoid



                    • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

                    • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.


                    To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




                    draft saved


                    draft discarded














                    StackExchange.ready(
                    function () {
                    StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fphysics.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f446482%2fno-ftl-information-implies-no-ftl-travel%23new-answer', 'question_page');
                    }
                    );

                    Post as a guest















                    Required, but never shown





















































                    Required, but never shown














                    Required, but never shown












                    Required, but never shown







                    Required, but never shown

































                    Required, but never shown














                    Required, but never shown












                    Required, but never shown







                    Required, but never shown







                    Popular posts from this blog

                    A CLEAN and SIMPLE way to add appendices to Table of Contents and bookmarks

                    Calculate evaluation metrics using cross_val_predict sklearn

                    Insert data from modal to MySQL (multiple modal on website)